Would you pay for TZAC if it was the last solution?

First of all, this is not planned to be done, so don't get scared. I was simply suggested by a friend of mine to do something like this in order to secure certain income and to keep the project alive for a very long time if no other solution is found (but there very likely will be a solution found). The idea is interesting and extremely simple, so I'm asking this just to see what is the general opinion of the community.

It is such a system that you activate your account by sending an SMS message from your cellphone (as text you enter GUID of the account you wish to activate) to a certain number assigned for your country. These SMS payment services support a large number of countries, everyone would be able to do it. The sum you'd be charged by your mobile operator would be around 0.5 EUR. Your account gets activated and you never have to send an SMS again (or perhaps once per year - not very relevant now, the sum is not real, it's just an example).

The simplest way to provide feedback on this idea is to vote on the right side of the page. If you have something more to share, please comment.

Source: http://www.tz-ac.com/topic.php?id=648
Comments
202
The SMS-collection is out of the question, operators take such a chomp from there that it won't do any good with such a low payment.

EDIT: But as for the payment, sure.
Would be okay for me as long the anti cheat works and gets updated.
yeah why not.
+ I think it would scare cheaters away as they would have to pay each time they get busted :D
What bo said
lol admins mad,
Sure, You can even charge 100e for it as long as it stays free till 15 May.
hahaha +1
Parent
Would definitely spend 50 cents in order to make ET more save.
I am ready to send an sms per month if tzac was really effective against all cheaters ... and I think many others will do it! But still awaited version 2 ...
i m ok with it
It's a free game and should stay free. I'm pretty sure that most of the inactive players wouldn't pay.
Le copier/coller te suffit ? :D
Parent
50 cent per year..please.
Parent
No, i'm selfish
toi tg ! =) see u @ nice =)
Parent
I did donate 5€ to chaplja, wasn't that enough?
you should consider a bigger amount of money to get rid of your red triangle
Parent
The one will be removed after 6th of August.
Parent
suck a cock and get rid of red triangle earlier
Parent
What about having a premium option. Like people who donate more than like 1euro get a months premium account. Which = TZAC without ads or being able to view screenshots while basic memebers cannot?
Donators shouldn't have ads, duno why they are there
And the screenshot idea is just stupid, the more people can see screenshots, the easier to bust cheaters :)
Parent
No, I mean like. Have a wait for 5 seconds adds before you load tzac. Might get people annoyed enough to donate! :>
Parent
Quakelive style.. Good idea :)
Parent
Admins can't check all screenshots thats why they are public


Example: about 2000+ screenshots taken everyday
Parent
I have never really looked at screenshots unless I get linked to some. The people who want to go through all of them will pay for sure.
Parent
:) its hard to look every screenshots that is made
Parent
Changing the format of the screenshots would be at least handy, for example being able to view them as thumbnails instead of a list/single image.
Parent
you can already donate to get donation status, which everyone can see and envy!
Parent
if you would ask ppl money for an anticheat programm, et would become definetly dead!
Yes because sending one SMS which makes it more fun to play, kills a game.
Parent
i don't get it?? more fun to play becauze you play???

if you meant indirectly if we pay its going to be more safe (banning more cheaters) i doubt so, because khaplja was paid at the slac ages and there wasn't lot of bust + there was lot of bugs.
Parent
the idea itself is good ... and i would do it myself yes

but i think its not good to get new players ....
lets face this, its an old community with rarely new players. Still the old faces playing the game. & now we will have to pay for something that once was free? :))

I dont mind 50 cent once though!
Parent
ye true, saw him once at pukkelpop but never again please
Parent
I think the add method would be good.

Let it take 10s with adds before TZAC starts, 10sec with adds before you can view someones profile.
Donators wont have to wait, maybe add a direct connect function (copy paste IPPW to join fast) for them.
why put a delay to view someone else's profile? just wonderin? o.o
Parent
i guess he typed wrong :)


ql dont have any delay to view profile only to join game

and if u add this 10sec profile delay you won't get anything out of it so it's really useless to add 10sec profile delay
Parent
read below.
Parent
Futher on top someone mentioned to make profiles and therefore screenshots only viewable for premium users.
That would reduce the amount of screenshots viewed and therfore the cheaters busted with screenshots.
And since there obviously are a lot of people viewing screenshots of players, why not setting a delay to view the profile where the screenshots are linked?
That would annoy those hobby cheatbusters and they would buy the premium.
Parent
they will stop looking at screenshots then most likely its not a option.
Parent
I would pay, even though I don't use it for any game at the moment. Although I do recommend that you have a different method to pay, not just by SMS, because I've got scammed of SMS's before saying I will pay $1 but the in the bill it was like $500. So paypal, etc should do too! Also it will be a good idea because it would get harder for cheaters to test their hacks, cuz they will have to pay every time they get busted XD
alot of users don't use paypal so.
Parent
But a lot of users do.
Parent
how about multiple payment options?
Parent
always said we need a payment system for ET / anticheat

if it helps TZAC to be updated regulary i am the first one who will pay
LOL NO ! hoster pay enough the servers. no needs to pay license !
Parent
It shouldn't be as expensive since ET is still a free game and I can't see it working unless tzac is supporting all the different mods for ET.
It's just an option I gave chaplja to consider, not like he's going to do it just like that.
Parent
I would pay but I hink it's a bad idea. ET has to stay free if you ask me. Idea with ads/perium accounts sounds more appealing to me.
No, because I dont play ET more than 2-3 per month.

I know players like Estonia sac will definitely pay.
Already transfered money to chaplja, why mad?
Parent
I am fine, thank you :)
Parent
yes, as long as it is effective as an anticheat

having to pay could stop people making multiaccounts etc, but the payment may not be enough as a deterrent

e: also, could stop players ho only mix every so often from playing oif they get a message hen they log in saying they have to pay and not letting them play etc
No.
We have no guarantee TZAC will be update everymonth and ban all the cheaters.
I still have doubt on some players using TZAC and I don't think it's 100% effective.
+2 month without any ban. Dafuq ?
latest ET ban 1day ago.
Parent
QuoteET 00029811 Weo 23.02.2012. Permanent Heur/Hacked game


wat ?
Parent
sorry my bad. though system banned 1 guy last night but it didn't :) my bad.
Parent
that would just kill the etpro scene - or atleast split it. It would be hard for new players to join the etpro scene. People would move to other free games or back to NQ/Jaymod servers. I'm pretty sure that most of the inactive players wouldn't pay. It's a free game and should stay free.
how does it stops new players? They dont use tzac anyway if they just joined ETPRO cause its anticheat and only on few servers. most of etpro servers still running with punkbuster.

so it won't stop new players to play ETPRO they will be stoped at 3on3 wars only but let's face it alot of etpro players dont play 3on3 6on6 wars in these days and they never will cause ther isn't anyone to organise it for them.
Parent
it would make the competitive scene a lot weaker. After I became inactive I only played a few 3on3's with some of my mates from NQ. We only played ET when we were bored of games like LOL/COD4/CSS. Now I completely stopped playing ET, but I know that some of them still play from time to time. They wouldn't pay for a game they only play a few times a year. They would prefer buying RP on LOL or even a server on COD4 - because they play these games almost everyday.

You might be right that it won't stop players from etpro - but it would stop them from joining the competitive scene. Even if they only play 3on3 on a low level - they're still important because they keep this game alive.

Besides I have to say that it's nice of someone like you to post(or atleast repost it) something like this. You're atleast trying to make the competitive scene better and more enjoyable for this community. Others just keep whining that the game is dead.
Parent
Would be okay for me as long the anti cheat works and gets updated.
I'm poor but not that poor that I couldn't spare a few euros for this cause
consider yourself lucky not being a polak
Parent
i do, good sir, i do...
Parent
1 beer less then, ye?

i would pay izi x)
is cheap but since et is already free this is not good for ppl who dont want to pay and will result in less players and less new players that would wanna go into the etpro scene
Quake Live is free and nobody cares there (apart from the hardcore nutters)
Parent
care about what?
Parent
He's probably talking about ads.
Parent
but i wasnt talking about ads -_- but whatever, i care shit about et :D
Parent
to all the ppl who say that they would pay for it

why aren't you fuckin do it?

go to the tzac side and donate some € then this discussion is not needed.

but hey saying i would pay is much cheaper!
infuckingdeed
Parent
Sure, wouldn't mind paying a few cents each month. There could be even discounts if you pay for a few months in advance already maybe. First the user gets it cheaper, second the programmer already has some save payments (I think most one-click hosters are offering this).

I don't think this would affect the 'pro' scene at all, everyone who's currently playing will still play even if they have to pay a little.
I said either for one year or for the lifetime of the project, no per-month fees. That is 0.5 EUR one time only or one time per year.
Parent
how can anyone donate 0.5€ to you without paypal/whatever eating them up in fees?
Parent
It's easy to calculate taxes :
3.5 or 3.4 (:X) % + 0.25 cents (in euro)
Parent
Like potty said, I would happily pay (like the QuakeLive pro account) for things like the chance to see screenshots while others who don't want to pay can't. No ads and all that jazz!
do that and u can kiss ur et days goodbye.
Yes and no,yes to pay that money to help tzac,no because people will move to other games because they wanna play free this game,and because new players will not join etpro scene,and people that play mix games will leave et,i dont want to see et killed by tzaz,for me tzac is the reason that et is still alive,as i said above for me that answer is YES to pay,but i dont know how the scene will react,and mostly the NEW players.
what about that you get a 2 week free trial for new tzac players?
Parent
Its a good idea,you need 2 month trial so someone get addicted and decide to pay,2 week is nt much i think,or maybe 1 month would be good,2 weeks wont convince a new player to pay.
Parent
yeah but i say 2 weeks cause im afraid the system would be abused by players who don't want to pay and just make new accounts every time their trial expires
Parent
so true!2 weeks seems ok!
Parent
yeah sure
many ppl won't care if it costs something as little, but the problem will be that many will, mainly new players. ET is already too hard for new players to start. few my friends wanted to test it, but had too many problems with it.

yes, there's proper installers nowadays, but pb kicks from publics, complicated cfg, ETkey problems, too new GUID etc. this would be just another nice new "obstacle". just how it is.

It wouldn't obviously be problem for me and I'd expect it wouldn't be for anyone who're playing anything even near competitive.
ofc i would do it if others would do it too!
mitläufer lOl
Parent
if the price isn't high I would send SMS for sure
But my operator blocked my SMS rights.
1 EUR per month is quite oki. ET is a hobby and other hobbies cost money aswell. so...?
As stated in the news post, I am very close to finishing discussions with a possible new partner. I was suggested this idea by a friend and I just wanted to check the community's opinion in general, just in case option.

Please note that the news post does not state 1EUR per month, it says 0.5 EUR for either a year or for the lifetime of the project. Asking 1EUR each month from users would be too much.
Would that really make a difference, 0,5€ a year? Isn't that like.. Almost nothing?
Parent
No, it's not almost nothing.
Parent
Tzac got what? 60,000 ID's and lets say about 5000-10 000 are real accounts. Multiple that by 0.5 and you have a nice amount of money.
Parent
from those 10.000 how many would pay?
how would a guy who has been inactive for arround 3 or 4 months knows that he has to pay if he comes one day and just wants to join lets say a tzac pub server...?
i know many players that have tzac but dont have a clue what crossfire is or that this "poll" or discussion is on the table.
Not to mention not rlly many jaymoders or Nq players would pay to play a random clan war...
I think at least this would kill the few pub servers left and many random irc wars...

a better idea would be to gather all those guys who said "yes i would pay" and answered yes at that poll and ask em to donate ....2 euros or 5 euros or smth and that way you keep tzac alive forthose who wanna pay and those who dont wanna pay or have no clue about it.
Parent
you would get rich, bitch :D
Parent
Yes and no

I dont mind paying, but as long as every player has to pay, I dont want to technically pay for another player if that makes sense
Makes no sense stfu ffs
Parent
you can only play on an anticheat server as long as your tzac acc is activated. so everyone that wants to play, has to pay. --> you pay for your account only.

thats how i understand it
Parent
Yeah if it's based on funding and activating YOUR OWN account then it will be good!
Parent
i would
is cheating really such an issue anymore? its never been a big issue in 6o6 imo
even if it was 5€ a year per player. if the anti cheat works fine i guess everyone would pay it. the whole game is free so why not pay a little to keep it alive. and cheaters would have to pay a lot more since they'd have to activate a new account every time they get caught --> less cheating attempts.

the problem i see, is the public scene. the guys that have no intention playing competition and dont really care. publics will turn off tzac and the servers will be overrun by cheaters. that will kill the game even more i guess. but i dont care for public nubs so.. :)
+1 for public scene,they wont pay.
Parent
not be be a dick, but no I wouldnt

sure this game is fun, but paying for a practically dead game.. no dont think so

e: didnt see the 0.5€ a lifetime, thats practially nothing -- and ive gone past that already in a donation I did some time ago.. so personally that wont be an issue, I dont like the idea in general though
ET has always been free so why should it be an advantage to pay (very little) at this stage and for the condition ET is already in? I would have said yes probably 5-6 years ago.
That's doesn't sound legit, coming from a F2P game, we should now pay, but since the AC is implemented by a non Et developper that makes sense.

But how much money do u need to keep tzac up actualy ?

Premium account looks nice, need to develop some new features tho, would mean more time working on TZAC engineering so even more costy.
50 eurocents a year
Parent
he dosen't have the money :(
Parent
Quotebut since the AC is implemented by a non Et developper that makes sense.


not sure if stupid
Parent
Quotebut since the AC is implemented by a non Et developper that makes sense.


not sure if stupid
Parent
Quote But how much money do u need to keep tzac up actualy ?

not sure if frog
Parent
there he didn't answer, i was speaking about the main budget, how much per year does it cost to keep tzac up, not how much a player does have to pay per year.
Parent
Don't think he will tell that publicly
Parent
why wouldn't he, guess it's kind of normal to me.
Parent
yes, i'd be okay with paying up to 2€ a year

IF

- there are updates to keep up with the latest cheating bots
- theres a guarantee it works (how could we know?)
- everybody has to pay
- i know where my money is going (directly to the developers/programmers and not just in the hands and pockets of some randoms)
I wouldn't mind to pay, BUT:

- everyone has to pay
- better service. Last ban was a bad example of how TZAC works.. Ppl got false negatives and had to wait for 1 month
- lifetime bans, right now it's too easy for cheaters to comeback
if u get caught with cheating you will get LIFETIME ban from tzac ( CB & ESL add 6months or more.)
Parent
Ye i see, thats why most cheaters are playing again :P

Unless TZAC v2 brings a better system, it's useless.

Plus 0.5€ is not enough. I hate to waste my money, but cheaters can easly pay this to activate a new account... make it 5€... at the end of the year they will be pooor :D
Parent
ther will be don't you guys worry about that.
Parent
you get a hardware ban. buy new hardware and your unbanned. and IP bans aint that diff. to
Parent
I know, but even hw ban could be a bit better...
Parent
im not very proud of it but im not even a real hacker like those others and still i can play again.. i mean its to easy.. ;p
Parent
exactly.. thats what doesnt make any sense...
Parent
i wouldn't tbh. very good reason to quit et hah
there should be instant banning and kick from the server.
whole system will work fine and fluidly then i would pay for it
bust some real cheaters and lets talk again
Make it free for players who never cheated during all those years.
0.5 euros per year is nothing. Of course I would.
i would pay for etlive, every antycheat is hackable anyway
You know it ;)
Parent
This should make all the cheap fucking polaks quit.
I know this probably comes with problems of its own like duplicate accounts, but would it be possible to allow people to play for free for a certain amount of time or amount of times played before paying, might eliminate problems with more casual players. The suggested fee is low, but might be inconvient for some.
I get the feeling that this would mostly make the casual players pay, and then I bet they would rather switch back to PB. Or smth. :P
Parent
Even if the game is free and I don't play with TZAC nowadays, I would say yes if it works and gets updated.

Though I think not just the anti-cheat system, but the whole ETPro scene need a good promotion for getting new players and getting users from the different mods. Something is needed that clearly shows the advanteges of this competitive scene. What could the players "win" by changing the mode or paying for the anti-cheat software...

This could be done, but only if the nations join together and do it in the national sites, ranking sites, small comunity sites, etc. This would be a huge project, but I think not impossible. Still a lot of players playing other modes and know nothing or less about the competitive mode. I did not checked every posts, but I hope the next version of Crossfire.nu can be a good base of this.
As far as I know new CF is supposed to be something like that. Obviously it will take time to get everything together to one place but I think it would be worth it.
Parent
Yes I would pay - but then I would demand the following:

- TZAC for linux users
- Instaban (instead of the silent detection with updates every two months or less).

If the above is solved, I would have no problem paying for an anticheat.

Or to quote Gordon Gekko:

"nothing in the free world is for free".
got a cellphone from my job i cant do any payment with so NO, but i can agree to pay something like 0,5 € in other way but not each month
stop killing et even more than it already is!
It would work if ET had a strong community with many top teams that don't quit every 2 weeks.
As of right now, payments will just split the community and encourage less active players to either just pub or find other games.
In other words, you will have the same handful of people playing competition and they will quit really soon because nobody else will be coming in to compete with them.
I would.
If it works, gets updated, and if its for more games than just ET (e.g. CoD) then yeh, I probably would.
I would pay.
The main problem of tzac is the lack of transparency, everything seems hidden, there is clearly a lack of communication/information even if it's better than at the beginning of the project.
I'd pay, but I don't think most people would. As somebody who's already into it, it'd be worth it. However, if I were a new pubber coming to ETPro (not that many these days, but still...), and was told I had to pay £x.xx to some random guy/service I didn't know just to play a scrim, I think I'd say "no thank you".

The only way you could charge users would be for some kind of added feature (some additional "premium" service, that people might like — e.g. like dropbox, you pay to get more space, etc.), but that wouldn't inconvenience somebody who just wanted to play.

If you wanted to be really obnoxious, the TZ-AC client could display some kind of giant ad, that you'd need to click away from/close, before you were able to login — and then if you pay "x" amount a year you don't have to see the ad, or something like that. The idea wouldn't so much be making money from the ad, but getting enough people to pay to get around them (similar to what QL does with its annoying video ads).
sure, worth paying
People should never be FORCED to pay for it. If you implement an sms system to donate, I'll surely do it, but doesn't anyone here dare to force me.
You're dangerous man.
Parent
Band aid on a gunshot wound, but yeah I would do it.
Those paying a monthly subscription would have the privilege of removing their own ban once a month!

And now seriously, a better option would be to consider a "freemium" plan. Something along the way QuakeLive handles it's premium members. By simply not showing any advertisements. The TZ-AC cliënt could also show an add for ~10 seconds before it really starts. Logically, those paying wouldn't have to wait and view the advertisement.
Premium subscribers would stand in for those playing with a regular account, and most of your costs will be out of the way. A monthly subscription would be needed to maintain a constant flow of income. I'm talking about a relatively low amount of money. Some must understand that writing such software is time-consuming, especially for a mainly 1-man team.

Edit: Apparently many agree when I read the comments above me.
Edit2: Unbelievable how people seem to whine about €0.50 monthly...
buahahaha

"0.5 EUR. Your account gets activated and you never have to send an SMS again (or perhaps once per year - not very relevant now, the sum is not real, it's just an example)"
I think the ads like in quakelive is the best solution ! If you don't want ads, just pay !
it would surely be a last stab to an already dying game
Personally, if asked to buy software, to use along side a free game, I'd politely tell you to fuck off.

There is a word for this, it's called positioning.

I think your trying to use this scare factor, and rely on the naivety of the users, and desire to play, forcing them into a corner, and paying.
At least you're polite in saying fuck off :D
Parent
Your like me, you see the positive in every situation.

Except this proposal above.
Parent
The only one being naive is me. The ones 'forcing' (not literally) me to continue doing for free is the community. I'll tell you to fuck off without trying to be polite at all.
Parent
Hit a nerve did I? It's nice to see someone in your position acting so moronic.
Parent
Yeah you hit the nerve.. replies like yours are the only ones for which I don't feel any reason not to act moronic or whatever you want to call it.
Parent
You can't ask for opinions, then be upset when you don't like one. Opinions are like bum holes, we all have one, and they all stink. If this upsets you, don't ask.
Parent
Wash yours, it stinks way too much.
Parent
That's a job for Jeeves, my butler.
Parent
Therefore, fuck off.
Parent
dont got 0.5 euro centsssssss :(
khaplja should be more active imo.

e: this game is way too dead to pay for.
Just play without anti-cheat then, its more easy to get a well aiming pracc opponent. Nowadays every random dutch and polish who used to be med+ without AC are low.
over my dead gibbed body.
not gonna pay for a game that is so inactive like ET is now!
Doesn't it work? It's free at least!
Parent
Dont get how those ppl can whine about paying 0.5 euros a year.

This game isnt as dead as some ppl think or would like to think.
Just get it started, there will be enough ppls who will pay.....and if there will be some who dont....well just a few idiots less.
you can get 1 energy drink with 50 cent
Parent
honestly to pay for such a shitty anticheat... if tzac 2 would be better than the previous version there would be no problem but if its going to be as poor as the tzac we got now its pointless to pay for nothing
Ofc 0.5€ is nothing but this will definitely stop even more new players to join et/competetiv et.. would do it for et, wouldnt do it for any other game i just started to play
Chaplja should post numbers of his running costs so most of this whiners can see what's this all about.

No i won't deffend TZAC and it features cos we all know that tzac have some epic fails, but with tzac we atleast have some fear factor against cheaters.
NO Tzac=et competitive scene gone,in other hand yes there is certain fear that paying for tzac might get away newcomers to wars/scrims but with some stuff you just have to gamble.

Paying few euros per yer via mobile phone shouldn't be much imo but paying every time you wan't to play or every month that's another story the one i can't commit myself to.

Those were only my two cents on this story :)

On a side note nerds that are constantly repeating et is dead/dying etc...i keep wondering myself why're you browsing and commenting at this site than or various other et sites why o why?
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